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Tarkov studio claims it actually doesn't have the server capacity for everyone who bought the game for $150 to play its upcoming PvE mode, still wants players to pay extra (www.pcgamer.com)

submitted 4 months ago by ylai@lemmy.ml to c/gaming@lemmy.ml

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[-] Naz@sh.itjust.works 108 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

Yeah honestly, I bought Tarkov second-hand for $8 and even then I felt like I was getting ripped off.

It's probably not news to anyone but the game has extremely lax anti-cheat controls.

As for why people would cheat in an online game, it always seems obvious from a psychological standpoint, but the cheats for Tarkov are so egregious they're like full blown developer offline DEBUG TOOLS.

I don't mean "oh no, aim assistance, and they can see you through walls" -- the cheat tools are hooking into features of the GAME ENGINE ITSELF, allowing players to see:

PlayerName, Current HP, Current Level, Full inventory contents, currently equipped weapon, position, heading, estimated value of inventory, estimated value of your account, age of account creation, and so on.

They can also: Teleport, FLY, increase or decrease their run speed, jump height, and so on.

The cheaters are basically running around with admin privileges in the game, and the developers don't give a flying fuck. It's like GTA5 levels of cheating.

Why would anyone play such a game, much less pay $150 to be abused by people? You can slam your dick in a car door for a lot less.

[-] semperverus@lemmy.world 52 points 4 months ago

Whats sad is that people keep wanting more client-side anticheat to fix this, when the real answer is server-side anticheat and changing the engine to stop being so leaky with that much information.

[-] huginn@feddit.it 12 points 4 months ago

It's easy to just handwaive and say "Server side will fix it" but here's a major issue:

You have to render people in before they appear. How do you do that without the client knowing where people are?

[-] Saik0Shinigami@lemmy.saik0.com 29 points 4 months ago

but here’s a major issue:

You're acting like other games have never successfully ran server-side before. Hell the whole net engine doesn't need to be server-side at all. But you can run server side checks on shit at the very least. A player being 100 ft in the air is likely a cheater... A player making a shot through impenetrable terrain is likely a cheater. Tarkov is missing these basics. Forget ESPs and other bullshit.

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[-] ProgrammingSocks@pawb.social 10 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

If the trajectory and speed says either the client or another player will cross a wall soon where the player sees them THEN it could send the data to the client. You need some tolerance for ping up to maybe 200ms but that's it. Wallhacks could give you at most a flash of a couple specific people.

[-] huginn@feddit.it 3 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

You need to account for every gap in the wall, nook and cranny and peephole for these sightlines. You'd have to bake so much detail into every calculation server side that it would effectively be rendering the entire map to host a single game.

[-] ColonelPanic@lemm.ee 5 points 4 months ago

There are many ways of doing this. I know the source engine uses visboxes, which are calculated once at map compile time. It takes a while to compile, but it means that clients can use the pre-compiled data to calculate parts of the map that are visible and the server can use them to determine what the player can see at a given time. I'm not sure whether it does that or not, but it would make sense to use that data.

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[-] thantik@lemmy.world 5 points 4 months ago

You do something called raycasting to determine visibility beforehand, and don't render anything not visible.

[-] misterdoctor@lemmy.world 9 points 4 months ago

lol raycasting isn’t optimized for server side deployment, it would increase the poly count of the mesh tenfold, which would in turn increase average ping and fps. Couple that with the client side rendering problem and I don’t know anything about development just kidding

[-] huginn@feddit.it 4 points 4 months ago

Your suggesting the server maintain a real time render for every single player and somehow manage to get the data back to them in less than 17ms so that they don't have empty frames that suddenly become people?

Because that's a ludicrous requirement in terms of latency (ping is totally reasonable at any value under 100ms) and server capacity.

Because your solution sounds like it would cause popping constantly and be a major burden on the server, which is already the largest overhead on a released game.

[-] 30p87@feddit.de 4 points 4 months ago

By rendering people, as in sending data about an object that should be rendered, in a few pixels before they would be visible. And not at all on distances, without a scope (as they would not be visible). Footsteps etc. could be represented by two noise levels precalculated by the servers very roughly, so you can tell someone is there behind you, but a cheat could not determine where exactly.

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[-] cbarrick@lemmy.world 8 points 4 months ago

Cheating is such a hard problem.

Like, this is what leads to invasive client-side anti-cheat. Which also happens to be one of the main blockers for OS portability.

But if you make it so that the server has to constantly validate the game state, you get terrible lag.

You really have to design your game well to deter cheaters. And you have to empower server moderators to ban cheaters. This sorta implies releasing the servers so that communities can run their own instances, because these studios don't have the resources to handle moderation themselves.

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[-] Jorgelino@lemmy.ml 8 points 4 months ago

I mean, i'd argue that a car costs a bit more than $150, but i see your point.

[-] themusicman@lemmy.world 8 points 4 months ago

Call an Uber

[-] Crackhappy@lemmy.world 5 points 4 months ago

I'd rather pay someone else to slam my dick in a car door for 150 clams.

[-] helios@social.ggbox.fr 4 points 4 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Cheaters are a big problem in this game. To experience the cool parts of the game without all the bulshit, there is still SPT-AKI for playing solo and also the SIT mod for PvE multiplayer coop.

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[-] TrickDacy@lemmy.world 80 points 4 months ago

Who the fuck is paying $150 for a fucking video game? Sounds like suckers who got scammed

[-] GregorGizeh@lemmy.zip 45 points 4 months ago

*for a new game mode in an existing game

[-] SmilingSolaris@lemmy.world 30 points 4 months ago

Actually the game mode is on a pack selling for 250$

People who already bought the 150$ price only get a 6 month free trial of the game mode.

Or they pay an extra 100 to upgrade

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[-] thesmokingman@programming.dev 22 points 4 months ago

The $150 isn’t for the new game mode. People that paid $150 were told they’d get all DLC. The devs are saying this isn’t DLC and these folks will get it for free once the game is out of early access. People that paid $250 can play this now. People that paid any more will have some level of discount to purchase access to this mode.

It’s all in the article.

[-] SkyezOpen@lemmy.world 4 points 4 months ago

Star citizen taught them well.

[-] verdigris@lemmy.ml 3 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

There's nothing remotely close to this in SC history. Also full access to SC is actually less than the cheapest Tarkov package.

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[-] digdilem@lemmy.ml 6 points 4 months ago

It's actually 250 euros for the top tier (267 $us)

I mean, seriously, what the actual fucking fuck?

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[-] rickyrigatoni@lemm.ee 3 points 4 months ago

Rubes.

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[-] Railcar8095@lemm.ee 50 points 4 months ago

If only there was a way for dedicated fans to run their own servers for PVE co-op with friends...

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[-] avater@lemmy.world 42 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

They are a Russian Developer with contacts to military units who support the war in Ukraine and also mocked Ukrainian with screenshots in their game...so why expect you no shitty behavior from them?

Stop supporting them and let their game fail.

Sources:

https://babel.ua/en/texts/80120-escape-from-tarkov-and-war-thunder-developers-keep-silent-about-the-war-and-stay-friends-with-the-occupiers-world-of-tanks-creators-are-still-on-the-russian-market-trying-to-please-everyone-and-save-p

https://ain.capital/2022/12/30/escape-from-tarkovs-developers-showed-the-middle-finger-to-the-stylized-soldier-of-the-ukrainian-armed-forces/

https://www.reddit.com/r/behindthebastards/comments/16kicn6/escape_from_tarkov_is_full_of_vatnik_propaganda/

[-] Phegan@lemmy.world 6 points 4 months ago

Source? I would love to confirm this. If it's true I will stop playing instantly

[-] ILikeBoobies@lemmy.ca 13 points 4 months ago

From what I found they have made no comment other than “they will not leave any markets due to war”

As for being Russian

"We have a mix of talent, some veteran developers, some new to game development. But everyone loves guns and FPS games. One of the studio leads is actually a former Spetsnaz officer, the Russian equivalent of the U.S. Special Forces."

Nikita Buyanov https://www.polygon.com/2016/6/3/11841338/escape-from-tarkov-has-us-excited-about-the-hardcore-survival-genre-again

[-] Phegan@lemmy.world 3 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

I am aware they are Russian, and I don't expect them to actively condemn the invasion, as it would be dangerous for them. If there is proof they were actively supporting the war or mocking Ukraine, that's a different story.

[-] avater@lemmy.world 3 points 4 months ago

I am aware they aren’t Russian

they are a Russian developer, they moved their office to london but still maintain their office in St. Petersburg

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[-] CosmicCleric@lemmy.world 38 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

Fellow gamers, if you don't push back against this nonsense now, you will be living with this treatment as customers for a long time, if not forever.

~Anti~ ~Commercial-AI~ ~license~ ~(CC~ ~BY-NC-SA~ ~4.0)~

[-] fckreddit@lemmy.ml 4 points 4 months ago

This. People paying hundreds for a skin in CS and hundred for a new game mode that they might not even get into are the reason things we get games like Suicide Squad.

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[-] bl4ckblooc@lemmy.world 19 points 4 months ago

This makes me happy I never got to play Tarkov.

[-] Ultragigagigantic@lemmy.world 16 points 4 months ago

Grey Zone Warfare is almost done, why would I give money to tarkov devs, especially now that everyone can plainly see they'll do shitty shit to their playerbase?

[-] DrJenkem@lemmy.blugatch.tube 16 points 4 months ago

I was a big fan of the game. Always thought it had potential to be great. I had already quit this wipe pretty much as soon as I hit Max traders. Don't think I'll be returning back next wipe.

[-] HowMany@lemmy.ml 15 points 4 months ago

Interesting aside - gamers continue to enable these thieves by "leasing" their products. Boycott? No?

[-] Phegan@lemmy.world 5 points 4 months ago

Many streamers are actively boycotting right now

[-] bastonia@lemmy.ml 9 points 4 months ago

Not one of the stupid people whod pay for that. So whats the problem?

[-] Cethin@lemmy.zip 11 points 4 months ago

The previous most expensive option ($150 I think) included all future DLC. Now they added this game mode and charge $250 for it, and the players who payed extra earlier don't get it included.

Also, I'd totally return to the game for a while for this mode assuming there aren't wipes ever. That's my issue with the game. I don't like losing all progress every few months. I don't want to play the game enough at once to reach the end game in that period. I only payed for the standard edition though, and I sure as hell am not paying $250 for this.

[-] DarylDutch@lemmy.world 5 points 4 months ago

Look into the SPtarkov mod. It is regretfully only single player but you can just relax and sometimes do a mission or 2. It also has mod support to remove the things about the game you find tiresome.

Every now and again I fire it up and play a map or 2. I have had the same character for over a year now.

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this post was submitted on 27 Apr 2024

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