this post was submitted on 02 Jan 2024
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Showerthoughts

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A "Showerthought" is a simple term used to describe the thoughts that pop into your head while you're doing everyday things like taking a shower, driving, or just daydreaming. The best ones are thoughts that many people can relate to and they find something funny or interesting in regular stuff.

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[–] 4grams@awful.systems 148 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (11 children)

For me anyway, the modern web feels like the realization of those early internet pioneering ideas. I run my own personal site, with a nice open source google photos replacement, hosting my own VDI, streaming services, you name it. It’s all running on a pile of discarded speak and spell’s in my basement (a joke but only barely, this junk will run on anything that can host a container). It’s all possible thanks to the open source shoulders of giants I’m standing on and in spite of my lack of coding experience (I’m dev/ops). The fact that I run more infrastructure than my first few jobs combined, as one hobbyist, kinda blows my formerly teenage brain.

It’s still out there, just so long as you are willing to DIY. I am holding great hope for the fediverse, although I’ve been getting used to disappointment lately.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 39 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

That's the spirit. I hope this did not discouraged you in any way. This post was never intended to bring you down, but rather to raise some awareness to how beautiful the internet could be...Yes, I'm making this up. Tbh it was just a literal showerthought - I did not think this would discouraged anyone. I'm very sorry!

[–] 4grams@awful.systems 15 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

No worries bud, I get the feeling and it’s completely understandable when looking at the current landscape. It’s been an amazingly shitty run of luck for me lately so I’m clinging to hope.

This is why I like shower thoughts, makes for great conversation :)

[–] Katana314@lemmy.world 14 points 10 months ago (4 children)

I don't ever see a server like that standing up to popularity.

In early days, you could maybe get 100 people interested in your site, and that was really cool - it might mean you have to get a second spare computer to load balance. But now, you go beyond 30 people interested, and you'll have an army of bots scraping the site, people re-hosting anything interesting you made (animations, videos) on YouTube and TikTok so there's no reason to go to you, and someone deciding to DDOS you for the hell of it.

[–] 4grams@awful.systems 17 points 10 months ago (7 children)

I’m not interested in traffic. I’m literally a bored old dude who plays with junk. The only purpose for the site is me to play but I post for fun in case anyone stumbles across it. I’m delisted from everything.

Back in the 1990’s as a teenager I loved my little part of the webrings of personal, pointless sites full of random crap. I’d check in on friends on their personal sites and geocities pages that overused the blink tag and animated gifs. That’s the classic internet that I’m talking about, and I fully embrace it on my little pile of shit. But point taken so link removed just to be safe.

[–] sirboozebum@lemmy.world 8 points 10 months ago

I miss that old internet.

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[–] StupidBrotherInLaw@lemmy.world 10 points 10 months ago

That's the spirit! One of the great things about the Internet is we can build our own alternatives, like with Lemmy and DIY servers. My friends and I have our own little Internet ecosystem. Outside of some Lemmy time, my personal Internet usage is largely served by our arrangement.

[–] brenno@lemmy.brennoflavio.com.br 9 points 10 months ago (3 children)

What do you use as a Google Photos replacement?

[–] 4grams@awful.systems 9 points 10 months ago

There’s a few out there that are pretty decent. I actually use two at the moment but will consolidate eventually.

Been using Librephotos for a while now: https://docs.librephotos.com - tried a few but landed on this one not for any real technical reasons, I just like the interface and it’s easy manage.

I also use https://immich.app - I started using it as a simple way to backup my families phone photos but it’s on such a furious development pace that I’m pretty sure it’s going to replace librephotos for me as well someday.

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[–] _number8_@lemmy.world 86 points 10 months ago (4 children)

i remember growing up I'd literally get a buzz off a good thread or from reeling off a good post. it felt so incredible being able to communicate with people across the world and be taken seriously, evaluated on the merits of my words rather than dismissed due to age or race or anything. and most of all, it felt like this special secret between you and other dorks. now everyone has phones in their pocket. going on twitter is like going to mcdonals.

[–] Xendarq@lemmy.world 44 points 10 months ago

Well, at least we have Lemmy.

[–] InputZero@lemmy.ml 14 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I dismiss this comment because your age and race are ambiguous and everything else! /S

Seriously though I kind of feel like Lemmy has at least some of that nostalgic feeling. Surfing through instances, finding that one semi-active obscure interest community you fit right in with. It's definitely not the same but nothing stays the same.

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[–] Xer0@lemmy.ml 12 points 10 months ago (5 children)

The worst comment section of all belongs to Instagram. Absolute cesspool full of the most moronic people i've ever witnessed. Smart phones killed the internet. We need something that isn't THE internet, and is only accessible if you have the patience and knowledge to connect to it.

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[–] tunetardis@lemmy.ca 79 points 10 months ago (5 children)

I imagine you're probably talking more about content, but you've uncovered a pet peeve of mine having more to do with the structure of web pages.

The original vision of html was to have this beautiful format that flows text and graphics elegantly over whatever space you give it. I remember thinking this is great! One day we will have pocket-sized displays and the web is already future-proofed to work seamlessly in that world.

Then fast-forward to smart phones. By now, web pages were so rigidly formatted that they had to design special mobile versions of every site.

[–] knobbysideup@sh.itjust.works 40 points 10 months ago (21 children)

Marketing ruins everything.

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[–] originalucifer@moist.catsweat.com 33 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

well, at its heart, the 'www' was supposed to be a bunch of documents linked to each other contextually... in a similar vein Wikipedia handles things

you ever try and use the web without images? genX remembers.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 8 points 10 months ago

Yes, I'm mainly concerned with the content. HTML certainly gives you all the possibilities, but it has ultimately led to boring but easy-to-use and correspondingly restictive UIs. I think anyone who wants to reach a lot of people today will do so via social media (original Myspace unfortunately didn't work out, tho).

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[–] Hamartiogonic@sopuli.xyz 47 points 10 months ago (5 children)

One of the early utopias was that people would no longer debate about things because the internet would bring people together and provide them with information about anything and everything… well then algorithms and social media happened, and now we’re stuck with echo chambers of anti-vaxxers and flat earthers.

Other than that, it’s been nice in many ways nobody could have anticipated back then.

[–] RaoulDook@lemmy.world 20 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Social media empowered narcissistic self-publication, which is one of the main things that ruined the Internet.

The problem is that the subject of discussions was moved from objective topics to the self. Every topic being discussed is now tainted with the insertion of the self as part of the topic, for the purpose of garnering attention to the self. Instead of the topic being discussed, now it's "Look at what I'm talking about, isn't this interesting what I'm telling you?"

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[–] fruitycoder@sh.itjust.works 12 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I think the Internet really did make people more knowledgeable overall, but my personal theory is that, as a collective, we are in the area of knowing that dunning-Kruger effect takes place. With our current collective intelligence machines really crystallizing that to me, where if ask an LLM something it doesn't know, it will act like the average person on the internet and make shit up and assume it close enough.

The information age really speaks to the idea that information is not knowledge, but knowledge can be formed from information. I think the next major revolution and why social media algorithms, AI, data science, etc are so hot is because they are attempts to enter the knowledge age. To take all of this access to information and truly learn something from it, at the same scale.

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[–] originalucifer@moist.catsweat.com 39 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

i dont understand this at all.

theres nothing stopping me from building stuff for the web. dude, i run a social media server named moist

if your complaint is that 'users are hard to wrangle away from corporations', well, that has less to do with the internet and more to do with lazy/ignorant people.

[–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 36 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

i think the fact they use every psychology trick to hook and deceive them has some significant impact in this.

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[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 18 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Please don't get me wrong: I have the greatest respect for all those who try against all odds. I just think that the idea of the Internet utopians was that the Internet would promote enlightenment, understanding and education. I simply have the impression that the opposite has generally happened.

[–] cm0002@lemmy.world 25 points 10 months ago (1 children)

It's not perfect, by any means, but it's definitely having a net positive effect. Traditionally, the right has sustained themselves by getting the next generation "on their side" through various tactics such as messing with education and such. It worked pre-internet because small towns were somewhat isolated and the flow of information easier to control.

Gen Z, the first generation to grow up entirely online, has proven they aren't buying their shit this time around and I'd argue it's because of the Internet and all the information they can access regardless of if they're in some podunk town in bumfuck nowhere with like 300 people or a major city with millions

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[–] OpenStars@discuss.online 8 points 10 months ago

I know I thought that...but I was wrong.

There are these tiny villages in Africa, where people take laptops or tablets and a huge stash of DVDs, and often there isn't even a roof just like 4 sticks poking up from the ground, maybe a tarp above it or possibly not even that. People come from hundreds of miles away, even walking, and they can watch videos from literal Harvard/Yale/etc. professors on whatever subject - engineering, lessions on how to speak English, biology, physics, etc. The barriers for people who truly WANT knowledge are pretty much entirely gone now, world-wide.

Which lasted it seems for about a minute, while instead now, misinformation flows even more freely. Those setups that I mentioned above took DECADES to create, leveraging the technology available at each timepoint, and more than a little prep work to discuss with the recipient culture to let them know it is an option. And even then, situations such as Boco Haram continue to threaten their continuation, bc girls (& women) learning things is considered bad in that case.

Thus, I learned that ignorance is extremely easy to cure (barely an inconvenience, if you know that famous YouTuber's catchphrase;-). Entire courses are available freely online, such as the Crash Course series...of series (US History, World History, literature, biology, chemistry, physics, check it out!), and nowadays the most dumbed-down explanations of extremely complex topics as you could ever want, see e.g. this video.

The barriers nowadays to knowing things are "different". See e.g. the movie WALL-E, where the humans all just gave up and sat down... but then were never able to get back up again.

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[–] Art3sian@lemmy.world 36 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

I’ve been saying this for years. The internet was better when you had to be a little bit more intelligent than the average person to access it.

Back when you needed knowledge of computers and software, modems, anti-virus, hardware etc, it kind of meant you needed a brain in your head to gain access. I’m not saying that made the internet an overtly-intelligent space, but it was more intelligent and measured than it is today.

As soon a smart phones and data plans entered the game, you could be as dumb as a second coat of paint and gain access with a single button. That opened the flood gates for the stupid. Now the stupid are here en mass and internet is just a dumpster fire full of retards.

[–] FlorianSimon@sh.itjust.works 14 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Your post gives vibes of elitism... I don't think your intelligence argument holds any water. The Internet of the late 90s/early 00s was easy to access.

The difference from before is the advent of social media. The stupid have been on the Internet for a very long time now. But you would't hear them much.

I know we had bulletin boards before, but social media, particularly Facebook IMO, allowed more people to express themselves and gave everyone an audience.

[–] LemmyIsFantastic@lemmy.world 35 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (4 children)

The US is using 40% renewables, China a bit more, many smaller countries are testing 100% renewable days, ozone was mostly fixed iirc. Progress may be slow, but to say it's not happening is factually very false.

[–] Wanderer@lemm.ee 16 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Also the rate of change is accelerating.

No sign of slowing down yet. Except maybe for wind but hopefully floating comes into its own in the next couple of years.

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[–] jasondj@ttrpg.network 15 points 10 months ago

40% renewables for electricity.

Not to make perfect be the enemy of good, or to poo-poo that progress…but electricity is only 1/3 of GHG. And demand for electricity goes up with the move towards EVs, so while we take the energy out of the “transportation” column, we put it into the “electricity” column, at a 60% discount.

Thats…good. It’s progress. But it’s honestly such a baby-step in the grand scheme. We should be using green energy and EVs exclusively by now, and significantly cut down on meat and dairy consumption. We should be a lot further by now.

I blame Nader, the hanging chads, and Bush v. Gore…but mostly Nader. Had he not run in 2000, the majority of his voters, particularly in FL, would’ve voted for Gore. Nader got 97,488 votes in FL. Bush won by five hundred and thirty seven votes. That…the spoiler effect that resulted from an idealist candidate (and the shortfalls of FPTP, not to mention electoral college), is making perfect the enemy of good.

The same could also have been said of NH, by the way. 22,198 votes for Nader, Bush won by a margin of a third of that. Either FLs 25 or NHs 4 EC votes would’ve flipped the election and the course of history.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 14 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (3 children)

All probably true, but all the technological progress has done little to change the fact that we continue to destroy the world we live in with our eyes open. This is my point: technology is generally not used for the good of humanity, but for monetary gain. If we wanted to, the world could be a better place, but we don't use our resources that way - they are not managed by the general public, but by people who don't have the good of humanity in mind. I think the Internet is a good example of this: Tim Berners-Lee, the inventor of the www protocol, didn't earn a cent from a patent or something like that - he was just interested in scientific exchange at the time. In my opinion, that's a true hero, not Steve Jobs (he was a great businessman tho).

[–] bouh@lemmy.world 11 points 10 months ago (5 children)

This is a very pessimistic view, and with a fallacy. The fallacy is to consider that greed will always win and yadayada. The fact is that it is a product of liberalism, it makes states resign from doing things to the profit of companies. Even in liberal countries liberalism is being contested though, and power countries are opposing it (for better or worse).

Internet is still there. And in some places, it won true victories against liberalism, like in Europe where net neutrality did won some battles and big Internet companies are being contained, if only to fight US espionage.

My opinion is that Internet companies are incapable of sustaining their tools, because they're too greedy to provide a good service long term. Free solutions will appear, and ultimately they will prevail. Lemmy is a example that is at a baby stage yet. Most of the innovation and infrastructure relies on free softwares today. It's just in the background. Computer and Internet technologies are still in their infancy, it will evolve.

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[–] LordWiggle@lemmy.world 29 points 10 months ago (4 children)

It was meant for porn en now the biggest part of it is porn. I'd say a success.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 14 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

As far a I know the porn industry has actualy driven innovation in various web-technologies including streaming, e-commerce, VR...and now probably AI, I guess.

[–] phoenixz@lemmy.ca 18 points 10 months ago

We should put porn on climate change

[–] rambling_lunatic@sh.itjust.works 9 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The Internet is really really great 🎶

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[–] Ibaudia@lemmy.world 26 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I feel like it's still mostly fine for individuals who are savvy and know where to look. In summation, though, I think the abundance of mis/disinformation spammed on social media combined with a lack of media literacy is socially corrosive.

[–] Fungah@lemmy.world 15 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Social media is a huge part of the problem..

Stop using social media and 90% of the internets issues stop affecting you.

Search is still fucked tho

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[–] sbv@sh.itjust.works 16 points 10 months ago (5 children)

Content-wise, I think we aren't in a bad spot. There's a tonne of information available online that wasn't accessible before. Wikipedia is a pretty great example, but the millions of howtos scattered across Instructables, YouTube, and other sites are also pretty amazing. Yeah, there's monetization and SEO crap, but I think (hope?) it's a net positive.

Application-wise, I think we're also in an okay spot. Almost anyone can publish videos, text, and opinions on corporate publishing tools. If you want, you can spin up a private server with just a credit card, and do whatever you want with incoming traffic. Web browsers aren't quite Neuromancer/Shadowrun decks, but they do allow anytime to run untrusted code safely on a local machine.

Did all this free information bring us together? No. Not yet, at least. But I think that's what the early tech utopians got wrong. We aren't insufferable jerks because we don't know any better, we're insufferable jerks because we know better and choose to do it anyway.

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[–] Rolando@lemmy.world 12 points 10 months ago

"The trick is not to ignore the mainstream but to selectively raid it for things we can use." -Mike Gunderloy, back in the 80s.

[–] Vinny_93@lemmy.world 11 points 10 months ago (1 children)

It's almost as if something gets infinitely worse once the masses adopt it

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[–] Melatonin@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 10 months ago (1 children)
[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 9 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Thanks so much for that link! I have the impression that the point has been reached where there are enough users to abandon all open standards, which were certainly necessary to achieve a relevant user count in the first place. Now the so-called platform economy has become a reality. That was inevitable, I guess. All major social networks have been working towards this for a long time.

[–] supermario182@lemmy.ca 8 points 10 months ago (1 children)
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