this post was submitted on 22 Apr 2025
473 points (93.7% liked)

Technology

69211 readers
3455 users here now

This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.


Our Rules


  1. Follow the lemmy.world rules.
  2. Only tech related news or articles.
  3. Be excellent to each other!
  4. Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
  5. Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
  6. Politics threads may be removed.
  7. No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
  8. Only approved bots from the list below, this includes using AI responses and summaries. To ask if your bot can be added please contact a mod.
  9. Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed
  10. Accounts 7 days and younger will have their posts automatically removed.

Approved Bots


founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

Can't run Windows 11? Don't want to? There are surprisingly legal options

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] Pirata@lemm.ee 57 points 1 day ago (16 children)

Why even bother at this point? Linux has become so good it's actually easier and more familiar to use than the clusterfuck that is windows 11.

[–] HC4L@lemmy.world 169 points 1 day ago (3 children)

Linux user here, I really hate this kind of bullshit. Just stick with the facts there are loads of reasons to use Windows. And for a lot of people I would still recommend Windows.

[–] whaleross@lemmy.world 66 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Another twenty plus years Linux server and devices admin and user that found last year that Linux is finally mature and stable enough to replace my desktop too without having the fiddle with it every once in a random update. It was a decision that I can accept making workarounds for legacy windows software and l can live without other eco system. Yeah, there are plenty of reasons that people are still running Windows and keep doing so.

Don't make being user of an operating system your identity, people. It's just as annoying and unnecessary as those Apple fanboys we all know and dislike.

Exactly. I've been Linux exclusive for something like 15 years, and I'm usually the first to tell people to stick with Windows if there's even one piece of software they say they'll miss. If they really want to use Linux, they'll ignore me. If they would've bailed when something didn't work perfectly, they would likely write it off and never try it again, so it's better to leave that door open IMO.

[–] pocker_machine@lemmy.world 26 points 1 day ago

Exactly. These type of comments only come from an immature POV that how they use Linux is how everyone would use Linux.

[–] Buelldozer@lemmy.today 18 points 1 day ago (1 children)

And for a lot of people I would still recommend Windows.

Eh, only if someone needs it.

For instance my 75 year old father is happily using Linux Mint on his laptop. Why? Because all he's doing with it is web surfing, watching youtube, and checking his email. At home that's all most people are doing, especially older people. I set his up so that it backs up his stuff and auto-updates. It just works and if it does get broken I can recover it with minimal effort.

It's the same for me at home. My main PC is Linux Mint where I do almost everything. For the occasions I need Windows I have an Intel NUC attached to my KVM. For work I've got LM installed on my work laptop and when I need Win11 I have a VM setup in QEMU/KVM with it.

Are there people who have workloads, or gameloads, that only run on Windows? Sure there. We all know that.

But there are a lot of people, especially home users, who could easily run Linux and don't.

[–] Mondez@lemdro.id 10 points 1 day ago

This... It's not so much that I'd never advocate a windows install, it's that linux should be the first port of call and Windows be the specialist fallback for when Linux doesn't handle the use case well.

[–] PagPag@lemmy.world 48 points 1 day ago (12 children)

How well does Linux run Solidworks?

Oh right, it doesn’t…at all.

Linux is useful for many things but just doesn’t cut it for the majority of people reliant on single deal breaker items.

[–] 9point6@lemmy.world 16 points 1 day ago (1 children)

You're also SOL if you have a couple of decades of music projects in various DAWs (though predominantly Ableton, plus a decent number of Maschine & Reason projects, for me) using all sorts of VSTs from over the years. I keep several versions of some VSTs installed so I can open older projects, and those older versions are never getting patched to fix broken Linux support by the developer, even if a more modern version does get fixed. It's all got to come from wine devs, which frankly probably have more important issues to focus on.

I've tried a few times to get Ableton working with all my plugins and MIDI hardware and it's always been an exercise in madness ultimately resulting in failure and usually a lost weekend. It particularly doesn't like anything with my iLok key involved, last I tried a couple of years ago.

I happily run Linux elsewhere, but my main desktop is going to mainly run Windows for the foreseeable future unless something drastically changes. At least my projects aren't all in Logic!

There's also some software I use for my photography that didn't properly work on Linux when I last tried (e.g. GPU features in PureRAW are the main thing I remember), but I think there're some alternatives there I'd look at if I could get the audio production stuff working perfectly.

[–] Aphelion@lemm.ee 8 points 1 day ago

I've been working on getting set up for music production on Linux, it is possible, but it has a lot more challenges. Manjaro Linux running the 6.13 RT kernel has worked well for stability with Bitwig Studio and Ardour, but the amount if plugins that are impossible or very difficult to install makes it feel limited.

load more comments (11 replies)
[–] Tea@programming.dev 38 points 1 day ago (4 children)
  • To use Windows only and legacy software.
  • Some laptops don't support Linux due to missing drivers.
  • Some very old people hate change and would want to use windows 10 till the end of times, matter of fact I had seen a full office with about 5 desktops that is still running windows xp. (Spoiler alert:they got a ransomware 2 years ago.)
  • finally, Windows is idiot proof, meaning that it's kind of hard to ruin desktop windows during the normal operations. In comparison, a bad Linux update could fuck your boot loader beyond repair (it happened to me twice in fact, once on openSUSE tumbleweed and the other on Clear Linux).
[–] CeeBee_Eh@lemmy.world 6 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Windows is idiot proof, meaning that it's kind of hard to ruin desktop windows during the normal operations.

Are you new? Windows will barf all over itself and all your files doing regular updates. Happened to my wife's computer just recently. She has almost nothing installed on it aside from Steam and Chrome. Windows update turned itself into a hot mess, and it's a known issue. The only option was to do a completely fresh install of Windows.

Idiot proof my ass.

[–] swelter_spark@reddthat.com 2 points 4 hours ago

I agree. I had frequent problems when I used it, which could take days to figure out, and even then might only be solved by a full reinstall. Linux has had significantly fewer problems for me, and those problems are solved much more easily. My bf is a huge Windows fan, but it seems like he's struggling with some problem he can't figure out every other month. Half a drive left as unallocated space instead of being included in a partition, causing constant "disk full" messages, was the most recent issue. On top of bad updates. I don't bother suggesting he switch, because I know he's happy with it, but Windowt definitely isn't problem-free.

[–] Limonene@lemmy.world 24 points 1 day ago

I have to disagree about the idiot proof. KDE Plasma and Mate Desktop are more idiot proof and easy for newbies than Windows 10-11, yet have more features in their simple control panels.

I've had no bootloader problems in the last 10 years of Debian, Linux Mint, and Ubuntu (15-20 installs, plus another 20-30 if you count VMs.) However, my work computer's bootloader was semi-bricked twice in 2019 (Windows 7).

[–] Pirata@lemm.ee 10 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)
  • To use Windows only and legacy software.

This is a fair point. If you're a creator and need adobe software then Linux is pretty much a no go. However, a lot of windows software have Linux equivalents (and those

  • Some laptops don't support Linux due to missing drivers. are generally free as well), so its a matter of doing research.

If you pick the right distribution it may include all the drivers you need. So far I tested 5 distributions and they all worked straight out of the box. I'll test Linux on a Mac this afternoon and see how it goes, but I'm optimistic it will just work also.

Some very old people hate change and would want to use windows 10 till the end of times, matter of fact I had seen a full office with about 5 desktops that is still running windows xp. (Spoiler alert:they got a ransomware 2 years ago.)

Fine. These people who refuse to adapt to the world can just keep using windows. No skin off my nose either way.

finally, Windows is idiot proof, meaning that it's kind of hard to ruin desktop windows during the normal operations. In comparison, a bad Linux update could fuck your boot loader beyond repair (it happened to me twice in fact, once on openSUSE tumbleweed and the other on Clear Linux).

Now this "idiot proof" take is really funny. You see, I've been using Mint for about a month now, never having to log into Windows. Yesterday I needed to log into windows and was immediately met with an update (against my consent), followed by a blue screen of death and when I restarted my laptop my profile couldn't be acceded and I was instead logged into a safe Environment.

I ended up having to troubleshoot using the Registry to get my account back. If this is idiot proof I have no idea what you consider a system that just works (which is what Linux does in my experience). You'd feel like Heaven is on Earth. On another note, WiFi never autoconnected on login in on windows in my laptop, but it does on Linux.

As for the issues you had, I understand. Rolling releases aren't for everyone and if you're not particularly into tinkering or just use your laptop to browse the web, an immutable distro is pretty much unbreakable.

Otherwise, Linux Mint is very conservative so it won't break with updates (and in the rare instance that does, you can just use Timeshift to rollback the updates anyway).

[–] DJDarren@sopuli.xyz 5 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I'll test Linux on a Mac this afternoon and see how it goes, but I'm optimistic it will just work also.

I have Mint running on 2011 and 2014 Mac minis. It's basically flawless. The only trouble you might have is finding the wifi driver, depending on which model you're using. Iirc, the minis were fine, but the 2011 MacBook Pro I put it on was a little more difficult to track down. But ethernet worked right out of the box, so it wasn't a huge deal.

Linux on Apple Silicon is a trickier proposition, but getting less tricky all the time.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] ModestCrab@lemmy.wtf 5 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Windows is idiot proof

Could we at least add more idiot support to system crashes?

Windows has a QR code for you to scan, you can make a personalized recovery drive so that it restores your computer, ctrl alt delete gives you options to click on.

[–] MangoPenguin@lemmy.blahaj.zone 14 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (3 children)

Windows only applications mostly. The ones I use are Fusion 360, Photoshop, Lightroom, and NI Labview. Unfortunately CAD/Graphic design software also often really struggles to run in WINE, especially with updates happening fairly often.

I've thought of a windows VM, but that's just not worth the extra effort of dealing with hardware passthrough to get proper GPU acceleration.

I really like Linux, all my servers and VMs run Debian or Alpine. But it's just a lot of work for desktop use in my experience (yes I know some of you have never had a single thing break), stuff just randomly breaks for no reason, I'll do a system update and just get a black screen from botched GPU drivers, or back when I ran GNOME my extensions would randomly break after an update and never work again, sometimes installing a simple application like steam would nuke my package manager.

As much as people complain about windows and some do have poor experiences, for me it's pretty much set and forget, I installed W11 on my desktop maybe 4 years ago shortly after release and it's just.. there. It works fine, it doesn't break, all my apps, games, and drivers still work after updates.

[–] lightnsfw@reddthat.com 2 points 1 day ago

Fusion 360 is a big sticking point for me too. I tried FREECAD but it ran like ass on every system I've tried it on. I'm currently dual booting but windows already wiped the secure boot key once which rendered the Linux os unbootable somehow even after I turned off secure boot. That was like a week after setting it up. I hadn't even got started on the laundry list of other shot I needed to get working on Linux.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] Humanius@lemmy.world 16 points 1 day ago (2 children)

I've been trying out several Linux distributions over the past couple of weeks to figure out where to go after Windows 10.
I'm very open to switching. but if I have to be honest, there are still plenty of UX problems in my experience. It's frustrating enough that I keep going back to Windows.

[–] taladar@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 day ago (1 children)

How long did you try each one? Usually when trying anything new it takes a little while to get used to the things that you readily accept as "just how things are" with something you have been using for a while. I am a long-term Linux user and I can tell you that Windows has plenty of major UX problems when I occasionally have to use it on someone else's PC.

[–] Humanius@lemmy.world 8 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

When the keyboard doesn't work correctly, that is not "just how it is" though..

I'm not going to relearn how to type accents for the sake of switching to Linux. The OS should just work correctly out of the box, or at the very least give me the option to fix the behaviour without having to go 20 internet forums deep and delving into the depths of the system files.

I tried Mint for four days before getting fed up with things not working as they should, went back to Windows for a week and then tried Fedora for two days again running into very similar issues.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] Pirata@lemm.ee 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Which distribution did you try?

[–] Humanius@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Mint Cinnamon and Fedora KDE Plasma Desktop.

I ran into various issues, one of them being (for example) incorrect behaviour of dead keys for accented characters. That problem was present in both distros, and I even went so far as to unsuccessfully edit system files to get the desired behaviour.

[–] Pirata@lemm.ee 8 points 1 day ago (1 children)

That problem was present in both distros, and I even went so far as to unsuccessfully edit system files to get the desired behaviour.

What desired behaviour are you talking about exactly?

Because I have used those exact two distros, also with deadkeys since I type in Portuguese and Spanish alongside English, and deadkeys works just fine for me.

[–] Humanius@lemmy.world 8 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

So the keyboard I'm using is US International (with deadkeys), which is the standard keyboard for the Netherlands.

Certain key combinations should create an accented character, but certain other key combinations should simply print the accent followed by the character. Typing this way is essentially muscle memory for me, so if it deviates from what I'm used to it really trips me up badly.

Example:

', followed by e should type é (which Linux did correctly)
', followed by m should type 'm (where Linux typed an accented ḿ)
', followed by c should type ç (where Linux typed an accented ć)
', followed by ' should type '' (where Linux typed ')
', followed by [space] should type ' (which Linux did correctly)

I checked several forums, but there doesn't seem to be an easy way to change this behaviour in Linux. Dead key behaviour is seemingly consistent between keyboard layouts, and it can only either be on or off?

Edit: It shouldn't even be that complex of an improvement to the OS.
If they were to add a defintion as to how deadkeys are supposed to work as part of the keyboard layout file, this wouldn't be an issue. I could just make my own "US Intl. with Dead Keys (NL)" layout and it would be fine.

[–] Pirata@lemm.ee 4 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Hey, so I just tested this and you're right, it doesn't work as you described.

I suppose I unconsciously found workarounds and just ran with it.

For the examples you mentioned:

I'm is achieved by typing ' and then space.

ç you can get with AltGr+<

The other two, I have no idea what they are, but I trust your judgment.

I also went around some forums and yeah it appears other people report it doesn't work as it should. A bummer.

Maybe there already are some custom keyboard layouts out there you can download?

To get

[–] Humanius@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Wow! Thank you for going through the effort of figuring out whether there was a solution for me. I really appreciate it!

And yeah.. I could probably type all the characters I need to type through workarounds. But my problem is that I don't think I should have to relearn how to type in order to switch to Linux. It's a relatively niche issue I ran into, but I'm clearly not the only one running into it.

Which is a shame because I do want Linux to be more widely used than it is currently, and I think small annoyances like this are part of what is holding it back. It makes it more of a hassle to overcome the hurdle of switching OS.

[–] Pirata@lemm.ee 2 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Wow! Thank you for going through the effort of figuring out whether there was a solution for me. I really appreciate it!

You're most welcome!

Which a shame because I do want Linux to be more widely used than it is currently, and I think small annoyances like this are part of what is holding it back.

And yes, I completely 100% agree. Hopefully there will soon be a fix for this, because like you said, it really sounds like something that should be able to be fixed relatively easily, lol.

Anyways, best of luck to you in the future!

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] LedgeDrop@lemm.ee 5 points 1 day ago (3 children)

... because I have a Samsung Odyssey+ VR headsets, which needs "Windows Mixed Reality" (Windows VR) and was gutted/removed from Windows 11 (and doesn't work on Linux).

[–] mrvictory1@lemmy.world 1 points 10 hours ago

https://lvra.gitlab.io/docs/hardware/ According to this your VR headset works with "✅Monado SteamVR plugin" on Linux

[–] Pirata@lemm.ee 6 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

I hear you, but me get this straight:

Windows fleeced you out of a technology they were supposed to support for the years to come, but you're still gonna snide Linux and stay with Windows? Lol.

[–] LedgeDrop@lemm.ee 5 points 1 day ago

Well, unless this is an offer to buy me a replacement Quest or Pico (all of which, work on Linux) "yes, I'm going to stay with Windows 10" (and/or maybe dual boot).

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] Aphelion@lemm.ee 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

I wish I could use Linux for everything, but there are still things you need Windows to run. It would be amazing to be able to run Nuke, Houdini, Ableton Live and the Native Instruments manager on Linux, but it's not remotely possible now.

load more comments (9 replies)