Ask Lemmy
A Fediverse community for open-ended, thought provoking questions
Please don't post about US Politics. If you need to do this, try !politicaldiscussion@lemmy.world
Rules: (interactive)
1) Be nice and; have fun
Doxxing, trolling, sealioning, racism, and toxicity are not welcomed in AskLemmy. Remember what your mother said: if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all. In addition, the site-wide Lemmy.world terms of service also apply here. Please familiarize yourself with them
2) All posts must end with a '?'
This is sort of like Jeopardy. Please phrase all post titles in the form of a proper question ending with ?
3) No spam
Please do not flood the community with nonsense. Actual suspected spammers will be banned on site. No astroturfing.
4) NSFW is okay, within reason
Just remember to tag posts with either a content warning or a [NSFW] tag. Overtly sexual posts are not allowed, please direct them to either !asklemmyafterdark@lemmy.world or !asklemmynsfw@lemmynsfw.com.
NSFW comments should be restricted to posts tagged [NSFW].
5) This is not a support community.
It is not a place for 'how do I?', type questions.
If you have any questions regarding the site itself or would like to report a community, please direct them to Lemmy.world Support or email info@lemmy.world. For other questions check our partnered communities list, or use the search function.
Reminder: The terms of service apply here too.
Partnered Communities:
Logo design credit goes to: tubbadu
view the rest of the comments
If you go back a bit further, you realize this started with a genocide of Palestinians in 48 by Israeli forces, in the Nakba. And if you go further a bit even, you see that it started with terror campaigns by far-right Zionist militias in British Palestine.
See? I wrote above I would get answers from people with strong opinions insisting that their narrative was the only correct one. Thank you for confirming that.
Prove me wrong lmao. Just saying shit like this is worthless buddy.
And if you go further just a tiny bit you will see that the jews were being genocided all over the world in WW2 and if you go further even more you will see that jews were being targeted by Muslims for religious reasons and if you go further....
We get it. Your world starts way after ww2 so you can have an excuse for supporting antisemitism and in general religious wars.
This conflict started way before 1920.
Naaaah my friend. You are actually getting things backwards.
Ottoman Palestine and British Palestine both had Arab Muslims and Arab Jews living there. And they lived in peace. In fact, Jews and Muslims lived in peace for most of their histories in Iraq, Syria, Palestine etc.
The British, with their divide and conquer tactics, in the late 19th and early 20th centuries, started to put Jews, Muslims, Christians, Hindus, Sikh, all an any religious or ethnic groups against each other.
There was no conflicts between Muslims and Jews in Palestine before the British allowed the European Zionists to colonise it, armed and trained their right-wing militias and allowed them to form a government (the only dual colonial government in British history). The Zionist militias attacked and terrorised Palestinians (Muslims, Christians and even Arab Jews) under British oversight for decades before WW2.
There was mass migration of Jews from Europe to British Palestine (and other places) right before, during and after WW2 (understandably of course). This increased tensions, as Palestinians already felt they were being slowly colonised.
But only when the British officially left Palestine, and the Zionists declared the State of Israel that true violence began. There was a literal genocide of the Palestinians by the Zionists.
70% of all Palestinian villages and cities were destroyed. More than half of the people were expelled from the land, with a good portion also being killed, which is ethnic cleansing.
This is the start of the conflict.
Before it was the prelude. And now we live the epilogue.
Israel always intended on genociding the Palestinians, since the state was first created. It was in fact, built on top of genocide.
Yeah, it is infuriating that this history is being down voted. In fact, the secular Plastinian national movements (PLO and its constituent organizations) considered Plastinian Jews (ie, indigenous Jews living in the British Mandate prior to 1948) to be Palestinians.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Jews
The truth is infuriating if all you live by is ideology spoon-fed to you by the mainstream media. And it’s not even their fault. The system really is set up for the vast majority of people to fall into this brain melting rot.
But there is hope. I do believe this event is radicalizing people and making them question things a lot more than most others before…
Yeah, I really don't understand why people always repeat the line that "Jews and Muslims have been fighting forever". This conflict is a direct result of outside interference, and it seems difficult to understand why things were set up the way they were. I need to do much more reading, because from what I understand, there doesn't seem to be a plausible explanation, other than the powers that be wanted endless conflict. Generations later, you can't ask Israelis to give up everything they've known, but the Palestinians were made to do the same thing, already. It makes sense for Israel to do most of what it does, now, in defense of itself, but it doesn't make sense that we're here, in the first place. Meanwhile, the Palestinians are screwed over and over. There doesn't seem to be a way out of this that doesn't involve one group wiping the other group out. Nobody is going to come along and say "screw ethnic and religious histories, let's just be human and share the land".
The more and more I read and study about it, it does seem the main root of this issue really was anti-semitism. But maybe not in the way most people would think.
When the Zionist movement first started, it had a lot of opponents within the Jewish communities of Europe. Many thought it was “giving up against anti-semitism”. To in essence, accept that Jews and non-Jews really couldn’t live together.
One of the earlier and main proponents of Zionism, Herzl, said that Zionism and anti-semitism had the same goals. To separate the Jews from the non-Jews. He believed Jews were incapable of assimilating, and would always bring hatred to themselves. The dude was pretty much an anti-semite himself… (see evidence).
He is now a hero and considered one of the spiritual founders of Israel…
I really don’t think we’ll ever see peace in the region as long as the Zionist ideology has a stronghold there. It’s a racist, supremacists, chauvinist ideology.
The only way to peace is for a state to exist in the region for all peoples, religions and cultures to live together in peace and equality.
I know it might not seem like it from the mainstream media, but that really is what the vast majority of Palestinians want too.
You can ask anyone who lived there, and worked or lived among them. They are FAR more progressive and peaceful than they should be. Any other people would’ve been turned into much harsher and more bigoted angry people. But they are just sad. And it’s so fucking sad. To think that we will be witness to an entire people maybe stopping to exist. Just for the crime of existing.