I voted for Harris walz, but I think a lot of this is the fault of Biden for trying to run for reelection and sticking it out until July. I live in the south and I think the lack of a primary reallly hurt the ticket because a sizable portion of the people I’ve talked to felt like she was appointed instead of being elected, which is a bad move when public trust in our institutions is already at an all time low.

[–] Croquette@sh.itjust.works 63 points 2 weeks ago

This is all excuses. The fact that Trump made it all the way as the primary candidate for the GOP means that Republicans were okay with what he said and what he did.

For a normal person, it shouldn't even take a second to choose Harris. But this isn't the case. Trump won the popular vote and the presidency despite all the crazy shit because a sizeable part of the citizens voted him in regardless of the reason.

And not only that, but Republicans won the senate and well on their way to win the house.

It is about to get real bad, and Americans have themselves to blame for that.

[–] Krauerking@lemy.lol 25 points 2 weeks ago

Institutional democrats who thought they knew what they were doing and could ignore the base of the party is to blame. Biden being top of the list. Stubborn self assured who when finally pushed to change was only willing to do it on his terms. And made a decision for everyone, again.

One of the big stories is a Democratic party Mayor of a super Blue city being corrupt and organizing police to defend him and yet not a single member of the party has spoken out against it. Endorsed by Hakeem Jeffries.

Status quo is far more important than listening to their base right now and hopefully it changes instead of them once again thinking they need to head further right.

And for the love all things holy I hope the Democrats learn to stop "gaming" the election with specific counties in "blue walls" because they did advanced math that told them it was all they needed. Bare minimum should never have been the goal.

[–] Flocklesscrow@lemm.ee 5 points 2 weeks ago

100%

[–] Snapz@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

The people you talked to are bigoted cowards that wouldn't have been swayed by any of that shit - She has a vagina and she's black - That's all it was ever going to be.

You're hearing the thing they hope their neighbor would think of them after the fact, " I was this close, Bill... I just wanted more policy detail... More time... If only they didn't make me vote for trump".

Your neighbor fucking sucks, Bill - this is the time you pause, take a breath, and fully internalize that to inform your future interactions.

[–] GiveMemes@jlai.lu 22 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

Shit dude, I'm far left, believed that the only way to protect democracy was to vote for Harris, and then did it, but even I felt like she was appointed. Nobody wanted her as a first choice but we were forced to accept her when she succeeded Biden. She got 14 million less votes than Biden did in 2020. That isn't only because she's a black woman. It certainly plays a part, but we can't act like it wasn't just general voter malaise that led to this outcome.

[–] Snapz@lemmy.world 3 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

It's not "just" the fact that she has a vagina, its that that was always going to be the deciding factor. There's nuance in understanding the distinction there.

[–] GiveMemes@jlai.lu 7 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

So your argument is that she got 14 million less votes than Joe specifically because she's a woman? Because I struggle to see how it could be the "deciding factor" otherwise.

[–] Bacano@lemmy.world 8 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I agree, it's an oversimplification. The Democratic party has become the party of 'going back to business as usual' and refuses to lower it's commitment to the corporations that fund it. Trump won 2016 because he was a genuine establishment shaker.

Leftists need a rouge candidate who refuses to bow. Someone who shows promise of CHANGE and not business as usual.

[–] UltraGiGaGigantic@lemmy.ml 6 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Leftists need a rouge candidate who refuses to bow. Someone who shows promise of CHANGE and not business as usual.

Democrats have proven that they will sue to strip such a person from the ballot. How can they claim to defend democracy while hiding behind First-past-the-post voting?

[–] GiveMemes@jlai.lu 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Because first past the post voting is a form of democracy, whether or not either of us have qualms with it. What is not democratic, in any way, shape, or form, is disrupting the peaceful transfer of power, which Trump has literally done, not to mention the intended destruction of the federal system under project 2025, which based on your response, I can tell you've done no research into.

Are the parties both bad? Sure. Is one objectively and provably better for the democratic institutions of the US? Abso-fucking-lutely.

[–] Bacano@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

A lot of people criticized Dems for exactly this when Harris was appointed after Biden dropped out.

[–] IzzyJ@lemmy.world 0 points 2 weeks ago

Yes. That is their argument. Because most men of alll races, and even most white women favored him. He got less votes than 2020, and won the popular, got a trifecta.

[–] dream_weasel@sh.itjust.works 0 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

None of it should factor. At all.

The distinction between the candidates was clear enough:

I will lower your taxes (for billionaires), I don't like immigrants, and I will say all the stuff you think and the lefties made it bad to say. Also if I don't win I'm going to jail because, for enough money I will do whatever you want (for Russia, Elon, or anyone else).
I am an actual qualified candidate.

There was no choice. It was taxes and fear and tribalism with a special sprinkle of election interference attempts around the horn.

She was appointed? So what? Elect her because she's a better choice, then fix that problem.

[–] M0oP0o@mander.xyz 2 points 2 weeks ago

She was appointed? So what? Elect her because she’s a better choice, then fix that problem.

I think the issue (well one of many) with this line of thinking is that as she was appointed, even if elected she would not have been fairly elected. An issue with the Dems for many years now. People vote against things more then for them and the USA voted for trump over Harris. That nothing seems to have been learned other then "she should have won" or "maybe if we go farther right it will work this time" is a real mindfuck.

The Dems could "fix" that problem (since it is a party problem) but they don't, ever. This is as much a failing of the Democratic party as the failure of American democracy collapsing into a two party system.