Then you have a severely limited imagination and an equally dismal knowledge of history beyond the past century. Does the small things the church has tried to do to mend all the awful things they’ve done? Not even close, frankly I’m not satisfied they’ve even begun to redeem themselves for the inquisition and they likely may never in my lifetime. Likely not yours or in a thousand or in a million but they might one day. That small infinitesimal chance is the same as life forming on Earth. I’m hedging my bets on the house.

I’d condemn them.

This is what is irrelevant to my point. It’s not about how you judge others it’s about how others would judge you. Based on your logic of judging others harshly for the action of those that came before, you would be judged severely. Worry not for many would burn with you, myself included.

There’s never been an excuse for such behavior.

No but there’s been an infinite number of rationalizations used for it. Until humanity collectively became better and continues to do so it was a fact of life. Not an excuse just acceptance of reality.

I'm only judging the church and its shitty pope based on their actual words and actions.

Are you though? Because you seem reactionary only to what is in front of you. Not on the totality of human history nor through any perspective beyond your own do you seem to be making your decisions.

They're still an active hate group in 2024.

Yes they are but I can’t say for sure that they will tomorrow. Even if tomorrow they still are, still doesn’t answer for the day after or the one after that and ad infinitum until reality ends and no more chances for redemption could be had.

This is where you and I simply will not agree. I believe that everyone is worthy of redemption. What actually earns redemption is far beyond my point and what an organization as long and old as these fuckers would have to do truly stretches the imagination but it’s not an impossibility. I cannot judge what redeems others because I cannot judge what redeems me. All I know is that trying to be better today than yesterday has to be worth something.

Also, not appreciating you downplaying the fact that the Catholic church clearly believes LGBTQIA+ is a sin.

Is that what that wiki page you presented and I quoted for you says to you? Because to me it says that opinions are split and change couldn’t come soon enough but it’s coming as fast as it can. If that isn’t good enough for you then that is your own personal problem.