Ah, yes. Deescalate with Putin. Because he has shown himself to be such a reasonable man. If Ukraine stops fighting, Ukraine stops existing. If Russia stops fighting, the war will be over.

[–] Groucho_the_grouch@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 1 year ago

The Donbas and Crimea don't want to be part of Ukraine. The war between Donbas and Ukraine has been going on for 9 years. If the people of Donbas stop fighting, they will stop existing.

[–] gnuhaut@lemmy.ml -2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'm not going to die for my country or my government, why do you expect Ukrainians to die for this shit?

[–] Quacksalber@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

And because you wouldn't, clearly noone else would either, right?

[–] gnuhaut@lemmy.ml -1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Ukraine is conscripting people. They're preventing men from leaving the country. They are clearly sending people to the front who do not want to be there.

If someone sends me to die in this way I reserve my right to kill them in self defense.

Stop cheering this on.

[–] Quacksalber@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

If you want to flee conscription, I support that. But likewise, Ukraine has the right to defend its sovereignty. As of now, most of Ukraine's conscripts have been volunteers and, opposed to russian conscripts, they receive training in the very most cases.

And to hammer that point home, just like involuntarilly conscripted soldiers, the people in Bucha, the people in Kherson and the people in Mariupol did not choose to take part in this war. Whenever russia retreats, stories of torture, killings and abductions emerge. Leaving those people to suffer under russia is as inhumane as it gets. Not to mention, all the (war)crimes committed on russian occupied territory will never even have the chance of getting investigated if russia is allowed to hide them.

[–] gnuhaut@lemmy.ml -3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

How do you think the Ukrainians are receiving better training than the Russians? Not that it matters, I'm going to change my mind about sending conscripts to the front, whether they receive 2 weeks or 6 months of training or whether the Russians are doing the same thing. I'm not cheering on Russia's war effort, you're cheering on Ukraine's.

You think it matters to most people who controls what territory? Do you really think a country that has soldiers (whole units!) proudly wearing SS and other Nazi shit are some paragons of virtue towards civilians? It clearly would be best for civilians if the fighting stops as soon as possible.

If you believe all this stuff about good vs evil I've got a bridge to sell you.

[–] Quacksalber@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

One side has some units wearing Nazi iconography. The other side has state sanctioned torture, killings and deportations (and also Nazi iconography). Your comparison is a textbook example of false equivalence.